It's frustrating and sad. We want to change the masses but we can't even change ourselves. Our innate and reasonable search for happiness has become twisted. Now, bound by a network of desires we remain always in anxiety demanding a more comfortable situation. Contaminated with the philosophy of "Me and Mine;" When in fact we actually own nothing. Under the illusion that we are important. This illusion that's reinforcing our prestige and strength. Justifying our explotation of everything we touch. Intoxicated with our own splendor; refusing to recognize our real position. We are insignificant specks of life in this material creation. Part of something much bigger; and until we make a connection with the WHOLE purely. We'll continue hankering, and searching and placing our love in the impermanent. With open eyes and mind it's easy to see spirit from matter. We are not material beings but spiritual by nature. So how can we get any lasting happiness through this material body and senses. Yet we are still hungry. And we've been let down so many times before. Perfection of desire. The perfection of human life.

 

I first met the author, Satyaraj Das (a.k.a. Steven Rosen) in March 1988, to my great fortune, after being amazed by his first book entitled "Food for the Spirit - Vegetarianism and the World Religions." The book smashes down the man made barriers between world religious groups and dives into the essence of the non-sectarian spiritual thought: love of God, mercifulness, compassion, humility etc. Next he logically and scripturally prives how all the world's major religions support a vegetarian diet. By doing this Satyaraj reveals so many similarities between Eastern and Western thought. He has been studying Vedic (ancient Indian) philosophy for over seventeen years while simultaneously strictly practicing the devotional worship of Krishna (God). In 1975 he was initiated into the Gaudiya-Vaishnav Sampradaya (a disciplic succession of qualified spiritual authorities), which is a lineage that dates back thousands of years. In the last year, our friendship has grown and I'm always eager to hear him speak and give his realization or advice on certain subject matters, for he's not only a scholar of comparative religion but a sincere practitioner, who lives the life.Ray: It seems that we'll do anything to ease the pain of material life... from breaking promises to ideals, standards, etc. As we grow older, we become more and more attached to bodily comfort. Why is it that when most people are young they are so fired up and rebellious or at least looking for a good cause or somehting to believe in, and why does this seem to change as the years go passing by?

Satyaraj: Youth is full of idealism, and this is good. Unfortunately, that idealism is often misplaced, or directed toward a less than worthy object. Consequently, it causes pain and untold suffering. Why be idealistic about material life? The physical law called "Entropy" dictates that matter is subject to decay - it eventually falls apart. There's nothing to be idealistic about! Material pleasure may taste sweet in the beginning - but it's a killer in the end. It deteriorates. Spiritual pleasure, on the other hand, is at first hard to swallow. Regulation and disicpline don't appear very attractive. But these are the qualities that lead to higher pleasure. Renunciation, especially, is a much coveted goal, for only through renunciation of material things does one acquire the necessary consciousness to appreciate spiritual things. At first, it is quite uncomfortable to give up things we are accustomed to. But a greater "comfort" is available to one who pursues spiritual life, an ultimate comfort. It leads to a higher taste. So while materialists' plans for enjoyment start to fall apart, the devotee of God is starting to taste real spiritual pleasure. If we should be idealistic about anything it should be about pursuing spiritual life.

Ray: I had always believed that the intocixation of the body was not only harmful, but blinding... I just felt this world was intoxicating enough... who needs extras? Now I'm finding that although drugs were not my particular intoxication of choice, other things were... even music. Do you know what I mean?

Satyaraj: You're quite right. Just analyze: How do you define intoxication? It is a temporary life - but you have to come down. Material life is temporary. A truly enlightened person, then, would not indulge in mere sensual pleasure. It has a beginning and an. Consequently, it's more frustrating than enjoying. Take a good show for example. It has to come to an end! And afterwards you sit there and say: "Boy that was great!" It was great - but now it's over. When something great comes to an end, thats called frustration. But spiritual pleasure is called abhinanda ("ever increasing bliss"). It's a constant surge upward. Besides, a "toxin" is a poison. Why poison ourselves? If we're going to "intoxicate" ourselves with anything let it be with God.

Ray: I never quite understood equality, or how it manigests in our world... on the other hand we say that we're all created equal, with the same rights... yet no two bodies are the same. For example... my body and mind... if you compare it to Albert Einstein's... we definitely are not the same! Also we are said to have the same inalienable rights, but since we are so conditioned in this world it seems only the fortunate are born wealthy, and only the attractive or the intellectuals get any respect or fair treatment. What are your realizations on equality?

Satyaraj: Equality exists on the spiritual level. Bodies are different, and therefore there will never be perfect equalityon the material platform. Special intrest groups - for women, races, and creeds - will always crop up. But their focus is inappropriate. Because they base everything on the body, they are doomed to failure. In fact there are 8,400,000 species of life, and each are equipped with a particular sensual forte. Each has its own level of consciousness. Further no two living beings are equal. There is always distinction. Actually, you might be surprised to learn that even on the spiritual platform there are variant qualities. Fundamentally, yes, all souls are equal. Everyone is an eternal servant of Krishna - God, and everyone partakes of His qualities, eternity, knowledge, and bliss. But on the higher level, there are distict types of relationships that one may have with Krishna in the spiritual world, either as a bystander, a friend, a servant, a parent, or even as a conjugal lover. So there is inequality in this sense, but this is very advanced, and on this level inequality is absolute, coalescing with spritual equality.

Ray: At times people accuse devotees of Krishna of "escaping" from reality... I can defintely say this is incorrect. Actually the very people who accuse devotees are trying to escape or forget about thier greatest problem. That they very soon are going to have to face disease and death. They escape in their world of "organized unreality"... a world of intense effort, for makeshift goals which keep them from thinking of the "ultimate" reality. Sometimes they get a shot of sobriety if their friends or family members become sick or suddenly die. It seems that the slap in the face lasts for only a breif moment, then they soon reenter into their illusion of immortality.

Satyaraj: Brief moments of reality are rare, but, yes, as you say, they are useful. Especially if we use them as a catalyst to become more serious about spiritual life. You see, there is a detailed science delineated in ancient India's Vedic texts. This science, called Vaidhi-bhakti-sadhana, fully explains how one can enter into extended periods of reality. Why settle for cheap flash? Take the age-old process of spirituality seriously and you can actually live - at every moment - on this higher level. Anyway, devotees are certainly not escaping from reality - they are immersed in it!

Ray: So is there a chance for modern society? It seems that for every step forward, we take leaps and bounds backwards. Must we reject organized society altogether? It seems like there is no ther way! Just simple activities for survival seem to be contributing to the destruction of the planet... what's the solution?

Satyaraj: There can be no peace in a materialistic society. We've got to return to a more God conscious orientation under the direction of a qualified spiritual teacher. We've got to set up communities for "simple living and high thinking." Self sufficient farm communities can be set up in the country, to show the practical application of such a lifestyle. and city dwellings can be set up into preaching centers. To my knowledge this is now being done quite successfully by the International Society for Krishna Consciousness (ISKCON). This is the hope for modern man

Ray: Explain to me what you feel are the biggest illusions of life... for myself I usually think that someone is enjoying life better than me. From advertisments, to magazines and the like... they are arranged to entice us to emulate each other. This would make me push forward for this unreachable fantasy like situation.

Satyaraj: Yes, cognitive expectation plays an improtant role in our pursuit of pleasure. We have a particular mind-set and then we go after it. Unfortunetly, no matter how determined we may be, material life always falls short of our expectations. It's just not satisfuing. For example, we endeavor for happiness and we don't get it. That's not satisfying. We endeavor for happiness, we get it, but it doesn't live up to our expectations. That's not satisfying. We endeavor for happiness, we get it, it lives up to our expectations - but we lost it after some time. And that's not satisfying. All endeavors for material happiness fit into one of these three catagories.
Spiritually, on the other hand, always results in eternity, knowledge, and bliss - but only if one pursues it under the guidance of a bona-fide spiritual master. Then, even if one's cognitive ecpectations are dismal, the highest result will still manifest. But one must be perseverant. This, in fact, is the proof that spiritual life goes beyond mere cognitive expectation. But it must be practiced properly...

Ray: So everyone takes shelter in something...

Satyaraj: But only a fool takes shelter in something materical! Matter is like sand funning through your fingers. It soon disappears It's destined for destruction. Real shelter is spiritual. Only something that lasts can protect you from something that doesn't. Only reality can protect you from illusion. Only Krishna can give you shelter from "maya" ("that which is not").